Old Timeline is not now, unless...

[SuhnSolJashin]

The Broyles in the beginnning of Making Angels, that sends Fauxlivia into the Prime to get alternate Astrid (or Astro, as that's the first name Walter calls her) is the Broyles of the Prime.

The Broyles of the non-prime died. Remember?

So unless it's the Broyles from the Prime universe... This is a different universe/timeline.

[Omniscient_Jay]

Welcome to the forums.

You make a few incorrect statements in your post, however.

With both Peters having died as children, history was rewritten in a way where Peter never grew up and could not affect certain events in the way he once did.

Before, Olivia traveled to the Other Side to retrieve Peter, after which the Olivia switcheroo occured; however, we know that in this new timeline, Olivia never crossed over, having no reason to due to Peter having not been there (she was instead kidnapped while Altlivia took her place). So if Olivia never crossed over to begin with, she would have never had to find a way to try to get back, and Alt-Broyles wouldn't have needed to assist her, meaning he never died in the mass transfer.

So both Broyles and Alt-Broyles are alive in this rewritten timeline. The Broyles we saw at the beginning of 4.11 was Alt-Broyles; the Broyles we saw later in the episode during the first crime scene with Neil's first victim was the Prime World Broyles.

Also, this may be a different timeline (different history), but as it would seem, it is the same set of universes (same space, changed histories).

Hope this helps.

[SuhnSolJashin]

I know, I'm just saying I see many threads with people saying that this is the same timeline, same universe. When it's not. It's not because of the fact that Broyles is in BOTH worlds.

[Omniscient_Jay]

I know, I'm just saying I see many threads with people saying that this is the same timeline, same universe. When it's not. It's not because of the fact that Broyles is in BOTH worlds.

Ah, I see. Your post was unclear.

But in truth, many people actually believe that the worlds we are seeing in S4 are distinct and separate from the S1-S3 worlds; which is to say, different worlds, different timelines. While it's true that the timelines are different, it seems so far that we are dealing with the same physical space - or universes - as we always have.

Whatever the case is, it shall be interesting how this story arc will be resolved.

[SuhnSolJashin]

So why is Broyles in both universes if he died?

It can only be explained that this is a different timeline/universe than seasons 1-3.

[Omniscient_Jay]

So why is Broyles in both universes if he died?

It can only be explained that this is a different timeline/universe than seasons 1-3.

There are two Broyles, one native to either world. In this rewritten timeline, they are both alive and well by the time S4 starts.

A timeline refers to a specific history; in the old timeline, Alt-Broyles died because he was used in the mass balance transfer (trying to get Olivia home), whereas in the new timeline, he was not (because Olivia never crossed over in the first place).

History was rewritten due to a combination of consequences of Peter using the Vacuum machine, and September changing his choice of saving Peter at Reiden Lake in 1985; what we see in S4 is what would have happened if Peter had never lived and grown up.

And again, there is a difference between a timeline and a universe; a timeline is the history proper to a specific universe. It can be said, then, that the timeline of the Red/Blue Worlds were changed.

(As a side note, Blue World = Prime universe, and Red World = Other Side).

[dolemite]

broyles is alive because the situation was different regarding olivia being in the alt universe


since the beginning of the season we've seen observers discussing why certain people didnt remember each other, then just a few weeks ago you had an observer talking to this olivia

that should tell you that its the same people just the timeline was changed vs being in another niverse where things are slightly different

red arrow/green arrow for example

[SuhnSolJashin]

There are two Broyles, one native to either world. In this rewritten timeline, they are both alive and well by the time S4 starts.

A timeline refers to a specific history; in the old timeline, Alt-Broyles died because he was used in the mass balance transfer (trying to get Olivia home), whereas in the new timeline, he was not (because Olivia never crossed over in the first place).

History was rewritten due to a combination of consequences of Peter using the Vacuum machine, and September changing his choice of saving Peter at Reiden Lake in 1985; what we see in S4 is what would have happened if Peter had never lived and grown up.

And again, there is a difference between a timeline and a universe; a timeline is the history proper to a specific universe. It can be said, then, that the timeline of the Red/Blue Worlds were changed.

(As a side note, Blue World = Prime universe, and Red World = Other Side).

So there are TWO timelines for the TWO universes?

First timeline S1-3, second timeline S4?

There should be no controversial topics saying that the OLD timeline is what season 4 is BECAUSE Broyles is in BOTH universes. Because in the FIRST timeline, he died in the alternate universe.

I know this. I'm not confused. OTHER PEOPLE are confused. Like the guy who made the topic saying that there is only ONE timeline for the TWO universes.

Let me say this again: There are TWO timelines for the TWO universes.


To make myself clearer, THERE ARE FOUR OLIVIAS at this point in the story. But only Peter can access the other two in the ALTERNATE TIMELINE.

So there are 2 timelines and 2 universes within each timeline.

[Omniscient_Jay]

So there are TWO timelines for the TWO universes?

First timeline S1-3, second timeline S4?

There should be no controversial topics saying that the OLD timeline is what season 4 is BECAUSE Broyles is in BOTH universes. Because in the FIRST timeline, he died in the alternate universe.

I know this. I'm not confused. OTHER PEOPLE are confused. Like the guy who made the topic saying that there is only ONE timeline for the TWO universes.

Let me say this again: There are TWO timelines for the TWO universes.

As a rule, because the histories of both worlds were affected by the rewrite, I personally tend to use the singular term "timeline" to differentiate the pair of histories from both S1-S3 (the "old timeline", or previous pair of histories) and S4 (the "new timeline", or current pair of histories). Of course, each universe technically has its own timeline, so there have technically been four timelines at play over the course of the series (two Peter-less and two Peter-ed timelines). However, it is simpler to just refer to both histories using a singular term, especially since a singular variable is what separates them (this variable being the presence or absence of Peter).

The majority of users on this forum appear to have made a similar distinction, as the use of timeline as opposed to timelines is widespread on this site. So when people use the singular terms of old timeline and new timeline, they are in fact implicitly referring to the previous state of affairs (S1-S3) and the current state of affairs (S4).

Does this help put things into perspective?

[SuhnSolJashin]

Yes.

So... Why does Olivia 'remember' Peter in the next episode?