"You have been home all along"

[6955 kHz]

I am tentatively interpreting this remark (in the thread title) by September to mean that there is only one timeline. If you mess with history, those changes don't simply occur as a separate timeline. They alter THE timeline irrevocably. What do you think?

If so, the timeline of seasons 1-3 has been replaced with that of 4. And despite the fact that these changes were prompted by Peter's erasure from history, the fact that he was resurrected by "the power of love" (yes, I am making it sound as lame as it is), means that he is now meant to exist here, along with "his Olivia." It's cozy and convenient, but it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and explains nothing. Why did his Olivia so conveniently resurface so that he could be with her? How could history have been selectively "un-rewritten" only for a single person, and why?

[PB]

I am tentatively interpreting this remark (in the thread title) by September to mean that there is only one timeline. If you mess with history, those changes don't simply occur as a separate timeline. They alter THE timeline irrevocably. What do you think?

If so, the timeline of seasons 1-3 has been replaced with that of 4. And despite the fact that these changes were prompted by Peter's erasure from history, the fact that he was resurrected by "the power of love" (yes, I am making it sound as lame as it is), means that he is now meant to exist here, along with "his Olivia." It's cozy and convenient, but it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and explains nothing. Why did his Olivia so conveniently resurface so that he could be with her? How could history have been selectively "un-rewritten" only for a single person, and why?

Peter and baby Henry were the only one's removed from the timeline. Peter's return has yet to be fully explained, and it may never be explained, but his return may have been partially facilitated by the love shared between him and his Cortexiphan enhanced love interest. As you may recall there were never any explicit mentions of Walter having dreams about Peter like Olivia did and in addition to that Peter's astral form seemed drawn only to Olivia, not Walter, perhaps because of Cortixiphan?

One way or the other, yes love brought him back. Olivia's memories resurfaced from the overwritten timeline because of her bond with Peter. No history was ever "selectively un-rewritten" as you put it, rather is was traces of the overwritten history that bled back through. The reason this hasn't happened for others is because Olivia's bond was with Peter alone and only Peter was removed from the timeline, his removal is what changed things. If Peter's absence was the only thing that changed then why would other people have resurfacing memories? Only those with connections to Peter should have any access to resurfacing memories triggered by his presence. Now why people like Walter, or Nina, Broyles or Astrid have yet to recover any memories prompted by Peter's reemergence may be because none of them have the added enhancement of cortexiphan.

I think a cool episode idea would be Walter overdosing on a combination of LSD and cortexiphan in some half-baked attempt to recapture memories from the previous timeline so he may restore his relationship with his son.

[jade86]

As you may recall there were never any explicit mentions of Walter having dreams about Peter like Olivia did and in addition to that Peter's astral form seemed drawn only to Olivia, not Walter, perhaps because of Cortixiphan?

Olivia saw Peter in her dreams that's true, but maybe you forgot that Walter was the one who could see him in the lab throught mirrors. It's not coincidence that both olivia and walter were able to see him only when their mind were "asleep". Let's remember walter's state of mind always "out of reality" and Olivia could do the same only when she was asleep. I'm not sure cortexiphan has to do with that. It was a matter of connection between people.

One way or the other, yes love brought him back. Olivia's memories resurfaced from the overwritten timeline because of her bond with Peter. No history was ever "selectively un-rewritten" as you put it, rather is was traces of the overwritten history that bled back through. The reason this hasn't happened for others is because Olivia's bond was with Peter alone and only Peter was removed from the timeline, his removal is what changed things. If Peter's absence was the only thing that changed then why would other people have resurfacing memories? Only those with connections to Peter should have any access to resurfacing memories triggered by his presence. Now why people like Walter, or Nina, Broyles or Astrid have yet to recover any memories prompted by Peter's reemergence may be because none of them have the added enhancement of cortexiphan.

I think we are in a re-written timeline, because all the most important events have changed and both Peters are dead. But when Peter came back his presence resurfaced the old olivia's memories and this was possible thanks to their bond mixed to cortexiphan in this case. This explains why in this rewritten timeline olivia is the only one who can remember Peter, but the truth is that this Olivia even with this memories has no idea of why this is happening to her. It's like "oh..i remember this this and this...but i didn't experience it".

I think you misinterpreted September's words. He said Peter was not completely erased because of his traces still in this world thanks to his connection with Olivia and Walter in particular. This doesn't mean Peter managed to come back only thanks to love. Come on. There must be another explanation. Wyman said on twitter that we will learn more about Peter's spectacular return and i believe it has nothing to do with love.

[The_war_is_already_on]

Well with olivia back to being olivia, and peter already being peter, things are more or less back to pre-universe change anyway (character reboot sorta), apart from events (Which had its own reboot) allowing ZFT to continue its mission



-Which was perhaps the set up all along, they may have been writing for a ZFT face-off + observer driven overplot from the start (both season 1 things), taken this side journey of the red universe stories, david jones death etc, to give us more ride while the channel is still renewing season...

I am keen to see if they ever tie in Olivias uncles kayak etc, or "hes not dead" and some of the other season 1 juicey bits (what are those discs, whats MD doing in secret - MD "behind scenes" ep would be cool), but so far, it seems they are right about back into the old main arcs from the earlier show, season 1 and 2- which is pretty damn awesome IMO.

Go for finishing your arcs!

"Wyman said on twitter that we will learn more about Peter's spectacular return and i believe it has nothing to do with love."

IDK if the comics are even semi-canon, but theres a story there about the machine and peter. Perhaps theres some explaination in there, or perhaps as you say, a backstory we have yet to see.

[Lij]

I still hold to the idea of "Separate Realities." In that room of Bell keepsakes at MD in S3 there was the 1971 Carlos Castaneda book, "A Separate Reality: Further Conversations With Don Juan."

The question is how do you translate from one reality to the other. I have in the past assumed that the machine accomplished that. Now I am not so sure. Knowing Walter it could be cortexiphan or LSD or both.

[The_war_is_already_on]

I like the idea of a walter taking drugs (perhaps DMT and some of those memory worms) to get the old timeline memories

[djoe]

This timeline as a consequence of Peter mucking about with the machine. The powers that be could create a do over. However, they did not do that with Charlie so I predict they will not do that here. What they have in store for the rest of the season, I imagine would be some final showdown with Jones.

[fragaria x phile]

This doesn't really address your OP very well, but I'm going to put my interpretations of the titular quote.


1) "You have been home the whole time. She is your Olivia." So this is where Peter belongs and is his home. I'm not convinced. As much as I love Peter (really, I do), he never seems to truly belong anywhere, because we have yet to see a timeline without Observer interference. Walter's actions that result from his hubris and in degradation create a reality that wasn't 'supposed' to happen on an ethics standpoint, but at least Water ultimately acted out of love and passion and the free will of his own actions. This is why I think that in some interpretation of "belong," Peter belongs in the Redverse, at least as a boy. There could still be a war of worlds (with some differences, so the whole reset doesn't seem wasteful) because Bell would still skip out on Peter's funeral, ruining his friendship with Walter, possibly driving Walter to cross over to advance his ego (remember that while Walter and Bell were partners, Bell received far more attention and accolade). Anyway, Peter manages to find home in new places. I think it's a common experience to go through periods of feeling in-the-right-place-and-home, and not. With Peter, the situation is far more extreme, but the same human conditions apply. Blue Elizabeth gave him a home. When he lost his mother, and the house he lived in, and/because of Walter, he felt homeless in a way. Until he began to reconcile with his father with Olivia's help (and finding purpose in his work, and of course Astrid).

2) "You have been home the whole time. She is your Olivia." That actually does make sense, outside of the context of these new memories. If this was simply September trying to give Peter the message of "Look, I'm not going to tell you the particulars of what went on in the bridgeroom and our respective roles in resetting the timeline, and I'm not going to get into how this still doesn't undo my and Walter's mistake (btw, sorry we put you in this position)...but the point is, you were never supposed to live your S1-S3 life. This is what it's like without you. This is how your world should be. Olivia without you is Olivia. But now Olivia is not quite that Olivia. Because somewhere, out there, there's an inaccessible timeloop in which she met you during two extremely tumultuous times when she had nowhere else to turn (crossing over out of fear/being beaten and losing John Scott and reactivating her chemically enhanced psyche) and she's still dosed up with Cortexiphan and still extremely emotive naturally and doesn't have a rich personal life she senses a strong pull with you which helped your and her memories bleed through."

3) "You have been home the whole time. She is your Olivia." So you know how Peter said Elizabeth and Olivia more or less gave him a place to call home, drawing attention to the subjectivity of home? Well, that helps me both reject and embrace September's assertion. Rejection because if Peter didn't feel he was at home, how could he have been home the whole time. Acceptance because what if the whole time means that he's been home THE WHOLE TIME. What if September's telling Peter that in every universe, you find a home. That you are adaptive and have people that love you, and so you will always be home. It makes sense to me, and I like it because it doesn't write off the fact that Peter still doesn't quite belong here, even if it's a little too broad.

Edit: To clarify that these are 3 different interpretations and minimize the typo damage

[Omniscient_Jay]

I am tentatively interpreting this remark (in the thread title) by September to mean that there is only one timeline. If you mess with history, those changes don't simply occur as a separate timeline. They alter THE timeline irrevocably. What do you think?

If so, the timeline of seasons 1-3 has been replaced with that of 4. And despite the fact that these changes were prompted by Peter's erasure from history, the fact that he was resurrected by "the power of love" (yes, I am making it sound as lame as it is), means that he is now meant to exist here, along with "his Olivia." It's cozy and convenient, but it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and explains nothing. Why did his Olivia so conveniently resurface so that he could be with her? How could history have been selectively "un-rewritten" only for a single person, and why?

History post-1985 was altered; naturally, if both Peters died as children, many events from that point onwards would have unfolded differently, especially since Peter had such a great historical influence, either directly through his actions, or indirectly by being the catalyst of the inter-world war.

It's still the same space, however; it's merely that the events within that space were altered. So everyone is "Peter's", which of course includes Olivia, but also includes Walter, Astrid, Nina, Broyles, Gene, etc.

As for Olivia's memories, history isn't being unwritten for her; she still lived her rewritten life, and those events still happened, but her memories of it are being usurped by a new set. It's like the Olivia/Altlivia personality override of early S3. Olivia's life still happened, she just thought she was Altlivia, and had lived Altlivia's life. Except in S4, it's "Amber" Olivia believing (and now, accepting) that she is "Blue" Olivia.

The reason why these memories are surfacing and taking over is not quite clear yet, however. The only think known for certain is that Cortexiphan had a hand in it. With nay luck, we'll get more on why she is remembering a "past" life while others appear not to.

[Torey]

I am tentatively interpreting this remark (in the thread title) by September to mean that there is only one timeline. If you mess with history, those changes don't simply occur as a separate timeline. They alter THE timeline irrevocably. What do you think?

If so, the timeline of seasons 1-3 has been replaced with that of 4. And despite the fact that these changes were prompted by Peter's erasure from history, the fact that he was resurrected by "the power of love" (yes, I am making it sound as lame as it is), means that he is now meant to exist here, along with "his Olivia." It's cozy and convenient, but it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever and explains nothing. Why did his Olivia so conveniently resurface so that he could be with her? How could history have been selectively "un-rewritten" only for a single person, and why?

Ultimately though isn't the whole red universe existing wacked out too?
I think changing history is less intense than the fact there's another whole universe a short trip away!