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Thread: Pinkner and Wyman, going out of their way to make things difficult for viewers.

  1. #11
    green, green, green, red! PB's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Omniscient_Jay View Post
    Your dialogue, while humorous, isn't really accurate because we know the writers don't really care about the ratings*** (or are not daunted by the current ratings situation), or else they would have start tying things up by now.

    ***I say this with half-sarcasm, as P&W have stated how since ratings and renewal/cancellation are outside of their control (an arguable position), they concern themselves more with "telling the story they want to tell". Take that as you will.
    Indeed, it has been explicitly stated by both of them, especially Wyman who is particularly vocal about it, but I would like to know more about the muse that informs their writing style nonetheless, as it has been perplexing me for some time.
    Last edited by PB; 03-31-2012 at 01:10 AM.

  2. #12
    Enduring Memories Omniscient_Jay's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by PB View Post
    Indeed, it has been explicitly stated by both of them, especially Wyman who is particularly vocal about it, but I would like to more about the muse that informs their writing style nonetheless, as it has been perplexing me for some time.
    It's probably meant to be perplexing. Though who truly knows what kind of fat they consume to fuel their ideas.

    My definitive stance on this issue is that I don't really care, because so far as I am concerned, the fat lady (now skinny thanks to lipo) won't sing until the final credits roll; and if the sacred writer-viewer pact has not been upheld by that point, then I may begin to consider becoming peeved about all this.

  3. #13
    He's Not Dead Black Peter's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Omniscient_Jay View Post
    If normal Werecupines weren't ridiculous the first time, then Werecupines turning into Werecugoyles shouldn't really be all that surprising.

    I'm not bothered by it; in fact, I am rather intrigued by this development. We're basically seeing what Jones would have done had his demise not been untimely, so this whole Neoshifter/Amphilicite/Genetic Engineering/Alt-Nina and Alt-Broyles/World Merger thing going on adds an extra layer to the narrative, especially the events of S1; and Fringe is always at its best when it makes on consider the past in a new light/

    While it's true that six episodes remain, plenty of things can happen within that time. The only real questions that need to be answered at this point are S4-specific mysteries:

    -The bookends of September's journey (who shot him, and what he's going to do now that he has returned, and what the other Observers are going to do about it);
    -Olivia's purported fatal fate (which I suspect is tied to September allowing himself to get shot);
    -The precise nature of Olivia's memory overriding, and if other characters will or won't remember, and why in either case;
    -What the bacon fudge Jones is up to;
    -Where the machine came from in this timeline;
    -Why September thinks it to be important that Peter and Olivia unite;
    -Various character questions in this new history

    As for past season mysteries, there isn't a lot left to address, save minor ones:

    -Observer-related mysteries (GGGR pattern, Inner Child, Mosley, Beacon, etc.)
    -John Scott, the NSA, the Glass Disks, the Latin group, etc.
    -The machine's architect (explicit confirmation on who built it, if it was indeed built and not the product of an ontological paradox)
    -Various character questions (particularly with Bell, but also Nina, Jones [which we are getting in S4], etc.)
    -Robert Bischoff, Alfred Hoffman, WWII, Germany in general, and all the mystery pertaining to that.

    Most of this is not necessary*** to fully resolve, save perhaps machine and Observer-related fare.

    I guess the question really is whether six episodes is enough to both resolve season-specific questions and tie past threads (unless we in fact get another 13 episodes for a conclusive S5). I wouldn't think that they would introduce a thread that raises more questions at this point in the game without reason, so I suppose it all depends on how they follow through with Werecugoyle and Friends; because it felt like they were attempting to set the stage for what's to come.


    ***By necessary, I mean bring the majority of the narrative to a resolution, which naturally entails tackling the biggest and most significant mysteries.
    What you have listed above is a MASSIVE amount of ground for the writers to cover. Especially if they want to do it right.

  4. #14
    Enduring Memories Omniscient_Jay's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Black Peter View Post
    What you have listed above is a MASSIVE amount of ground for the writers to cover. Especially if they want to do it right.
    Perhaps. I imagine that a lot of it (particularly the S4 stuff) will tie into each other, thus killing many flying Werecupines with a single stone (ideally, anyway).

    I guess they could always have September the Expositionist to step in at some point if things get too hectic.

    All in all, though, I'm still ambivalent about the idea of resolution. We'll get what we'll get, at which point we'll decide for ourselves whether the Fringe experience was a worthwhile one or not.

  5. #15
    green, green, green, red! PB's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironheart View Post
    You're not the only one who is frustrated, trust me. I gave last week's episode a pass, even though I was completely bored of it. Seriously, I usually watch these shows twice to make sure I spot everything in them, and if I never see last week's episode again it will be too soon!

    This week's was just as bad. There are some great character development moments in this episode, but all of that is overshadowed by the ridiculousness of the case of the week. Now, I loved the first part of this episode when they were on the plane. I just watched 1.13 (The Transformation) a few days ago, and it was cool to see this episode start off with the same scene from what we saw four years ago.

    Then we find out it's not four years ago. It's happening in the present. Sure, because how many times have you been on two flights four years apart and had the same person sitting behind you, and the same flight attendants, and the exact same flight number? Never? Yeah, never sounds about right because it would never fracking happen!.

    Then we get to the were-cupine plot, and there's absolutely no mention of the glass discs the found the last time this case happened. There's a wasted opportunity. It could have provided some answers in the plot, some direction to point the division towards, but instead it was a squandered opportunity. And rightfully so, because who cares about data discs or answered questions when you can anthropomorphize porcupines and give them wings. /sarcasm.

    And then we find out that DRJ isn't up to some reasonable goal like merging the two universes in some attempt to save them from destruction. Nope, he's doing this because he wants to create a work with creatures he has envisioned. He wants to make some kind of paradise with parasites!

    Eight episodes left in what could possibly be the last season of this amazing show, and we get two episodes in a row ruined by craptacular cases of the week. Okay, we get it, doing episodic story telling will help new viewers leap into the storyline. But if the episodes are bad, new viewers aren't going to care, and the veterans who have been with the show since the beginning will be alienated.

    I forget who said it, but I think he/she is right. If this show hasn't jumped the shark, it's getting there.
    Yeah, I didn't even think about that! What the hell!?

    "Winged Antropomorphized Porcupines" Well when you say it like that sure, it makes perfect sense.
    Last edited by PB; 03-31-2012 at 02:23 AM.

  6. #16
    Liaison Fringie

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironheart View Post
    Then we find out it's not four years ago. It's happening in the present. Sure, because how many times have you been on two flights four years apart and had the same person sitting behind you, and the same flight attendants, and the exact same flight number? Never? Yeah, never sounds about right because it would never fracking happen!.
    Peter's erasure has moved the event from occurring in the past to the present. It also resulted in the death of the original buyer Conrad Moreau 5 years ago. (Before the events of "The Transformation" originally happened).

  7. #17
    green, green, green, red! PB's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Omniscient_Jay View Post
    It's probably meant to be perplexing. Though who truly knows what kind of fat they consume to fuel their ideas.

    My definitive stance on this issue is that I don't really care, because so far as I am concerned, the fat lady (now skinny thanks to lipo) won't sing until the final credits roll; and if the sacred writer-viewer pact has not been upheld by that point, then I may begin to consider becoming peeved about all this.
    Pure poetry sir, poetry.

  8. #18
    Loving Fringe-Forum! :) Fringie Polka Dot Gene's Avatar

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    I can't help but find all this outrage amusing. After all the weird and wonderful and just plain bizarre things that have shown up on Fringe over the years - it's flying porcu-bats that you guys just can't bring yourselves to believe in?

    Seriously?! LOL!
    Avatar by Eveybane.

  9. #19
    green, green, green, red! PB's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Polka Dot Gene View Post
    I can't help but find all this outrage amusing. After all the weird and wonderful and just plain bizarre things that have shown up on Fringe over the years - it's flying porcu-bats that you guys just can't bring yourselves to believe in?

    Seriously?! LOL!
    Porcu-bats!!! How dare they!!! Everything else on Fringe made so much sense!!!

  10. #20
    Meeting Mr. Jones Moviemath's Avatar

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    Hey everyone,

    PB, I thought your OP was a scream


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