The A/P thread - aka the anti-shipper thread
With the help of Omni-Jay, I'm pleased to begin the anti peter olivia shippers thread. I had no idea where to put this, since it didn't really fit into any of the threads in the characters section. Mods, please move if you feel the need. The A/P stands for "adamantly platonic", which was suggested by Omni-Jay. Great title by the way!
So let's begin the discussion with reasons why they shouldn't get together, how it might effect the show, etc. Shippers are welcome to present their arguments too.
Number 1 for me.. I don't want to waste valuable Fringe time on Love. Period.
EDIT: added manifesto
An open letter to Bad Robot, from the assembled Partnershippers here at Fringe-Forum.
Those who agree, please post your signatures below. If you disagree, please leave that for the other threads, as this is a document to be signed (or ignored), but not graffitti'd.
(This grew out of the creeping suspicion the show's writers are going to opt for a contrived love relationship between Olivia & Peter and blindly drive the sword of MEDIOCRITY through the beating heart of Fringe once and for all.)
All together now:
Dear Bad Robot,
What the Partnershippers DON'T WANT is a banal love relationship between Peter and Olivia, as foreshadowed by the way the two of them are filmed together, and as the originators have said. Friends is all good. Lovers? Oh puh-leeese!!!
We are AVERSE to waiting for this to happen - EVER, and aren't in this just to see either of them have random sex, or endless 'I-love-you-do-you-love-me?' exchanges. Heaven forbid they lip kiss [ear-shattering peels of thunder!].
The bell tolls for Fringe on that day.
We actually DO CARE about the storyline, and the CREATIVE development of the characters. We view a love relationship as lazy writing and therefore UNCREATIVE as an option. We encourage the show's writers to be strategic and resourceful and to consider a love relationship between Olivia and Peter as a fighter pilot in a crashing jet would consider the eject button - an absolute LAST RESORT!
Please don't jerk us around with fake kissing scenes [dreams/amnesia stuff]. We are hard core fans who wish nothing more than this show avoid the soap and cheese in favour of integrity and sheer excitement! YEAH!!!
Ignore us at your own peril.
Our numbers are increasing by the day.
Signed,
Vesh1717 (founder)
Omniscient_Jay (founder)
MovieMath (author)
Montecito (the one who suggested the creation of the Manifesto)
Fringe-Freak
Verasdi
Honghey
Mutsie
slane
paca0502
fringeee
And many more who sympathize with our viewpoints...
Last edited by vesh1717; 05-18-2011 at 07:47 AM. Reason: added member
First off , hello , i'm a P/O shipper and i've considered the possibility that it would ruin the show , but the thing is , J.J.Abrams and Orcci , and the other producers are really great , if they put P/O together they'll know what to do , i trust these guys , they do know how to write stuff , so it will not ruin the show .
And second, it's probably not gonna waste that much Fringe Time , the writers could create really great story lines about them .
Hope i made my self clear .
Hooray! Vesh made the A/P thread!
First order of business: selecting a title for those who identify themselves as Adamantly Platonic.
P/O has Benchwarmers, but what about us?
It has to be clever, catchy, and memorable, all the while retaining our ideologies concerning the benefits of a platonic status between Olivia and Peter.
Here are my propositions:
-The Countershippers (simple, but memorable)
-The Partnershippers (shipping a platonic partnership between Peter and Olivia)
-The Overarchers (who cares about relationships when an overarching storyline about inter-reality war is going on?)
-The Platodamants (a portmanteau of Platonic and Adamant, doesn't seem that attractive though)
-The Adatonics (variation of the above).
I personally like Partnershippers and Overarchers the best, but I would like to know what you all think.
So, what do you say?
"Peter and Olivia are like brother and sister"
Joshua Jackson
" They're actors , they don't know what's coming up "Originally Posted by Montecito
Alex Kurtzman ( i think )
Looks like this thread is gaining some momentum...
Alright, here is where I stand concerning this whole relationship issue...
I don't watch Fringe because of the romance. I watch it because of the thought provoking concepts, interesting, complex characters, numerous mysteries, and a gripping storyline.
If I wanted to watch romance, I'd go check out some derivative soap opera.
Now, I have considered that the possibility of a romantic relationship between our swashbuckling duo exists. There certainly exists a certain "chemistry" between the characters that shows the possibility of a flourishing love.
However, I fail to see how such a thing could work, given the numerous factors that prevent it from being a worthwhile investment, story-wise.
The story that the characters find themselves involved in is not conducive to a relationship, in my opinion. Who has time to be mushy when denizens from an alternate reality are crossing over to destroy us all?
I certainly don't. And I imagine the Fringe team wouldn't either.
These three (and Astrid, of course) will certainly come to depend on each other greatly in times to come. Which is why I lean more towards the "Dysfunctional Family" dynamic.
Three lost souls, trying to find their way in a strange and dangerous world.
that is the way I have always envisioned it.
Besides, the love thing seems very cliche. A large majority of male/female duos seem to have to fall in love at some point. A relationship for the sake of having a relationship in the show, simply because of convention, could possibly detract focus from the story, some I most certainly would not want to happen to one of my favorite shows.
The very thought of Peter & Olivia makes me cringe. I like them more as "brother and sister", one watching the others' back in a world fraught with peril, than
And even if the writers choose to go down this route, it probably won't happen soon, as once the knowledge of the character's histories (Peter's origins, Olivia's cortexiphan trials, etc.) surfaces, the team will most surely be subjected to hardships that could threaten to tear the team apart.
All of this to say that at this point in Fringe (which is still in its infancy), a relationship would be counter-productive. I can only envision them getting together further down the road (hopefully much further), at a time where it could actually serve a narrative purpose other than overused "pulling at the audience's heart strings" mediocrity which seems to plague a number of TV shows nowadays
Hopefully, this long, heavily biased rant of mine will provide some fuel for productive exchange.
If not, then I still wish you all a pleasant day.
Ok, first of all Jay... I like Partnershippers, but all of those ideas were pretty awesome. Great work. That's my vote anyway. We will see if anyone else chimes in.
As for your second post here are my thoughts
I watch Fringe for the science (albeit somewhat far-fetched), and NOT the love as well. I couldn't agree more that if I wanted a love story I would watch something completely different. And probably not a sci-fi show.
Of course I can see the possibility of them getting together too, but I just can't see it happening - and it being a good thing. I just feel like, if it happens, the show will start to centre around the relationship. I don't see any way to avoid that. I mean if Peter was in trouble, and Olivia LOVES him, or vice-versa, then the actions of the characters would be totally different. I do see them as more of a good friendship. I also agree that if it happens in like season 5 or 6.. then maybe I could deal with it.
Regarding cliche. I have noticed that the writers have started to move toward cliche lines, endings, topics, etc. over the last few shows, so I COULD see them wanting to have Peter and Olivia together. Simply because the writing hasn't been that great lately, and in my opinion, putting them together is cliche, bad, writing.
This thread is gaining a little momentum, and I expected some shippers to come and state their points... and I welcome them. I noticed the quote that Montecito posted, and I have seen it before. I think that was from last year though, and things have changed. Some of the comments made by Walter, such as last week at the beginning of the show, have me thinking that they will be together sooner, rather than later. I mean, why else would the writers put that dialogue in?
Anyway, that's all I have for now. I hope that there are more Partnershippers out there!!
Last edited by vesh1717; 02-02-2010 at 07:11 PM.
I don't want to become too involved in this discussion/debate, however this part of what you said stood out to me, so I thought I'd comment.
In my opinion, even if Peter and Olivia do become a couple, that doesn't mean that their romance will become the driving force behind the show. This isn't Bones or Grey's Anatomy, where the romance tends to be the main reason viewers watch the show. I think they could have the two in a relationship without it taking away from the main focus of the show.
I would rather the two of them become a couple more than I would like it if they brought in an outside love interest for either one of them. I kind of like the idea of the two of them as a couple. But if they go that route, I would want it done in a careful, gradual, almost subtle way. Like you, I wouldn't want that relationship to be all that we see. But I don't think it would ruin the show if they did put them in a relationship.
Edited to respond to Vesh:
Personally, I don't think their actions would really be all that different. They already care a great deal about each other: whether that's in a brother/sister way or a romantic way, it results in the same kind of concern and desire to protect each other when they're in trouble. I don't think that having a romantic relationship would change their actions because they are already extremely protective of each other.
I just feel like, if it happens, the show will start to centre around the relationship. I don't see any way to avoid that. I mean if Peter was in trouble, and Olivia LOVES him, or vice-versa, then the actions of the characters would be totally different possibly.
Last edited by mlj102; 02-02-2010 at 07:20 PM.
I’m not sure where I stand with this. Probably in the middle. On one hand I’m not overly fond of romance in anything, unless it has relevance. I like Fringe for the characters, the dynamics of those characters, the science fiction, the intrigue, and the storylines. In those respects it is a relatively strong show. I think a general consensus or worry is that pairings happen mainly for a particular demographic that expects to see one in every show or film they watch. That this is necessary for a female demographic or a wider distribution of an idea that doesn’t alienate viewers not invested in a particular genre. This can lead to unnecessary time covering false and irrelevant romantic relationships that can fretfully unravel the consistency and dispositions of the characters and fray a very hard earned balance on television regarding other components. I don’t need to see a romance in everything. I enjoy unique and genuine relationships on television, and in a respect I do see our main trio as a dysfunctional family.
However, the other aspect of this takes into account several other things. One is the writing. I’m of the opinion anything can be done properly with the right writing – the problem is this is rare. If anything outside of a platonic nature occurs between two people, it needs to amicably assimilate with the rest of the material. This is really tricky – having different aspects of a show strengthen the other. Emotional investment puts a higher stake in threatening or hard environments, and switched around – those environments and scenarios fuel emotional dynamics. I’m going to sound like a broken record, but the X-Files did this well. That was one of the few shows that I didn’t resent the pairing, because in its way it added to the series positively. Fringe already does this in a different manner– it’s just familial in nature.
As it stands now, I don’t care what they do as long as they do it well and it doesn’t disintegrate the show in any way. If they keep it as is, brilliant. If they decide to put Peter and Olivia together I wouldn’t be against as long as it’s done correctly. The problem I always have is that it never is done properly. So the issue and the hesitation come from a collection of empirical evidence on all the shows/films that have done this, failed, and the show suffered because of it. Therefore I’m not against it going either way, but just remain wary on how well and consciously the writers of Fringe execute their decisions. But on a personal note, I don’t want to see it in the forefront if they do go that way. It undermines the value and sincerity of both the show and the emotional integrity of the characters – ending up as counterproductive to the original reasons of pairing two people in the first place.
ok... Hello, my name is Agui and I'm a P/O shipper. () now that i got that out of the way. here's what i think.....
i liked the comment mlj made. even if they do see each other as a bro/sis relationship, thats not to say that when the other one is in danger they won't react based on their emotions. look at how Olivia let go of Newton to save walter, she let her emotions rule her in that moment (she wiped a tear away when she saw he was ok). they might seem all hardcore, cold FBI/Scientist but they care for one another.
now, im not sure how you feel about spoilers... but since i see Jay over on the spoiler thread all the time, it should be ok. in the episode this week, they say that Olivia has some sort of super-sensitive ability to detect the people from over there. now when i read this i thought that maybe that is why we see a dynamic between Peter and Olivia. bc she is, unconsciously, super aware of him being alter-Peter, and maybe this is some of those moments we see between them when she almost seems to know how he's feeling etc. (P/O shippers throw pitchforks at me here) i will admit i was a bit sad when this entered my brain. bc speculation seems to be what its best at, and my brain has no biases... one moment its all for P/O and then its on something totally different.
however my faith in P/O was revitalized when i read some more spoilers else where.
i agree that the relationship would have to be done very low key. i love Fringe for its Fringe-ness, the P/O stuff is just extra fun for me. (as a girl im a sucker for a well portrayed and angsty romance).
not to mention that realistically speaking, where else would these two find a relationship? they spend most of their time together, and it would be kinda hard to explain to your significant other what you at work.
with that said.... i think i both added something to this forum topic and still stood my ground as a P/O shipper.
BTW: i like Partnershippers. it sounds cool. and if you shall be our adversaries () you should have a respectable name.
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